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Post by ellpee on Oct 30, 2013 9:09:00 GMT -6
BACKGROUND: 2012 Roketa, 244 engine, replaced CDI at about 500 miles. Relocated CDI, relay, and fusebox to a home-built "rack" under the seat for ease of access (HATE removing plastics!). Added computer-style cooling fan to CDI. Added voltage meter to dash to keep track of what's going on with the charging system.
So, scoot/meter now shows reasonably good charging situation on startup, up to about 13v though never over. As I run around town, readings slowly drop, if I'm out for a couple hours with multiple stops along the way, by the time I get home the meter will be showing something in the 11's at idle, barely 12 at RPM, and 10.5 to 11 with engine off (bear in mind, having replaced the whatchamacallit with a relay, headlights are on as soon as the key is on, engine running or no.)
Thing is, after two weeks of fall (autumn) operation, I THINK I may see some relationship to temperature -- overall charging performance seems to be at least a little bit better in the cool morning hours, or on days when the temperature in general is lower.
Wondering if that makes sense to anybody, and if yes, what else I might do to keep the CDI cooler. The fan is definitely helping, I recall when I first relocated the CDI and had no add-on fan it got pretty hot pretty quickly. Now it's warm to the touch after a couple hours of running around, but not what I would call hot.
I should say, though, that at no point, brand new CDI, cool of the morning, etc., etc., have I EVER seen charging rates over 13v. Various posts here have suggested one should see as much as 14v, but not in my case.
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Post by JR on Oct 30, 2013 11:11:58 GMT -6
First of all this scooter has a history of low charging problems, some here have went to great lengths to improve it. Unlike it's sister the 257cc linhai the stator isn't as big and there are other added problems to boot. Now you must be referring to the R/R when it comes to charging, the CDI has nothing to do with charging.
Yes a cooler R/R can help but you're also adding extra amp draw wit the fan so the trade off more than likely isn't worth the trouble.
I'll give you a list of things that will get you to the 14 volt range and it's up to you if you want to do them? They are proven things that work and will help this scooter. At your present state you can't ride long before you're in trouble with the battery, remember if it drops to 10.5Vdc or lower it'll not run, it's a DC type CDI.
1. Replace all bulbs except the headlight bulbs with LED's even the instrument light bulbs, everyone knows of the instant amp gains.
2. Go through wiring plugs on the stator to the R/R and make sure they are making a perfect connection, me I soldier mine.
3 Replace the radiator fan, it's a known fact the fan on the 244cc model draws 6 amps, the fan they use on the linhai version draws 2.75 amps, it's a no brainer.
4. Put a "good" battery on the scooter. When I say "good" I don't mean one of the cheapos at Wally World I mean a good 14AH rated battery, expect to spend from $75 to $100 for a good battery.
You have a issue right now if you're getting down as low as 11 volts on your battery, simply put this makes the scooter unreliable and limited to short distances around home. Never had this issue with my scooter even riding in 100F temps.
JR
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Post by ellpee on Oct 30, 2013 16:48:08 GMT -6
OK, thanks, and yes, of course it's the R/R, not the CDI. Silly me. Of the things you list, radiator fan sound like the best bang for the amount of work involved, as I can actually see the fan when I peer underneath, ergo, probably no plastics removal needed. Of course that has to be weighed against the cost of a more efficient replacement fan.
After that, I think I can get to the tail/brake/turn/running lights without an inordinate amount of work; instruments, not as easy, so I'd be inclined to tackle that as #2.
I can of course google around myself, but if have any good links for the fan and the LED bulbs, please share them. The battery sounds like serious bucks, believe I'd be inclined to try the other things first and see what it does before plunking down a Benjamin for a better battery.
OH, PS -- will that Linhai-version fan work on the 244 Roketa? Probably not -- nothing's ever that simple!
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Post by bobf on Oct 30, 2013 19:15:56 GMT -6
ellpee, you have just suggested a good list for most of us. Light bulb list by type, color, and locations. Fan for replacement. Battery would not be a big problem if these items considered and installed. My battery lasted 3 years. With improvements in work load it should do as well and maybe a bit longer too.
So I hope your request will get some responses.
Right now in this area it has cooled down to rideable temps so I won't do anything for a while. But maybe nest hot season I may find time in the mornings to work on upgrades as I won't be riding in the over 100 days.
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Post by JR on Oct 30, 2013 20:55:44 GMT -6
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Post by ellpee on Oct 30, 2013 20:55:44 GMT -6
Well, you Da Man to at least some degree. Just because I hate removing plastics I'll replace as many bulbs as I can get ro easily with LEDs, and if I can find a fan that draws fewer amps or whatever, I'll probably replace that draws a LOT less amps. Research so far suggests there will be issues there with where the screws go. Beyond that, next opt6ion would appear to be a much, much better battery, which looks like it starts at about $80 and goes up to $140 or so, forgetting about shipping and whatever.
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Post by ellpee on Oct 31, 2013 8:49:27 GMT -6
Thanks, JR, that link is great, and cheaper than I expected, and the tape measure is helpful in comparing the bolt holes. Does anybody happen to know the bolt hole distance on the OEM Roketa/244cc fan, or have a picture or link to same? If all else fails I can just stand on my head and measure mine, but a picture or specs would be great.
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Post by JR on Oct 31, 2013 12:41:26 GMT -6
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Post by ellpee on Oct 31, 2013 17:05:45 GMT -6
Just came back from a ~3-hour run that has possibly rearranged my priorities in chasing down this problem. 20-25 miles I suppose, moderate temperatures (mid-70's), many stops and starts along the way. Voltmeter behavior more or less the same, BUT I paid attention to the engine temperature and the fan. Sho nuff, while the engine was still below the magic temperature of about 167F I was seeing something in the 12's on the voltmeter. As soon as it got hot enough for the fan to kick in, I started seeing numbers in the 11's. Let it sit and cool for 10 minutes and again numbers in the 12's until, once again, the fan kicked in.
So my conclusion is that Culprit #1 is that juice-eating fan, not so much the temperature of the R/R or anything else. Ergo, I may replace the fan first and see what happens, followed by the LED bulbs at $5 a pop, followed by a 14Ah battery if things still don't look good. Unfortunately it doesn't look like I can dodge the bullet after all on removing the plastics. I can see the radiator from the front, but the fan is mounted on the back side, and along with the side panels there's a splash guard or skid guard or whatever on the underside -- can't even see the fan without removing all that, much less do any modifications to the mounting bolts and brackets and the like.
Oh, about batteries, I stopped by at Batteries Plus and they have several grades of 14Ah scoot batteries, starting at about $50 and running up to $150. Some are Chinese, some are American-made. Warranties range from six months to two years. Anybody with experiences to share about Batteries Plus, please chime in.
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Post by JR on Oct 31, 2013 20:50:53 GMT -6
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Post by ellpee on Oct 31, 2013 22:06:48 GMT -6
Wow, pricey. Two places I checked today were asking about $5 a pop for LED bulbs. But will continue down this path, gradually, one step at a time until it seems like my charging system is at least holding its own.
However, about that "winter is coming" thing ... I'm in Tucson, man, we don't do winter here. Eatcher heart out! ;>)
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Post by bobf on Nov 1, 2013 9:48:17 GMT -6
You are right ellpee, we don't winter out here. But I will wait for summer then will start doing some upgrade stuff. In the high 90's and above, I won't be riding. I am in Casa Grande.
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Post by ellpee on Nov 1, 2013 15:32:03 GMT -6
Wow, reality check. Ran around today looking for LED bulbs. O'Reilly, AutoZone, Pep Boys, local motorcycle dealer, Radio Shack, and finally Batteries Plus. Most didn't stock/couldn't get the ones I needed, Batteries Plus could but they were between $10-$18 ***PER BULB***, which x 8 is big bucks for something as piddly as a lightbulb. So it's back to on line shopping and the links JR provided. But considering that the bulb project will cost me $100 or so and the fan replacement maybe half of that, methinks I'll be going with the fan first. Based on my observations (see earlier post) that seems like the primary reason for my charging woes, so might as well start there.
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Post by JR on Nov 1, 2013 16:52:02 GMT -6
There are a lot of bulbs cheaper but I know these are very bright and dependable but shop around you could easily cut the cost in half on these.
JR
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Post by alleyoop on Nov 1, 2013 17:23:33 GMT -6
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..BAD TO THE BONE..