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Post by ellpee on Mar 17, 2019 15:01:52 GMT -6
Leaning hard in that direction if I can find somebody who'll take it off my hands when it's not running. Checked again just now, connecting power lights up entire dash but nothing else works. No lights, no horn, no starter. Will postpone the verdict until I can install the new key switch and see if hooking up the remaining wires helps, but I'm by no means optimistic. Ah, for a good Magnum wiring diagram. I'm no electrical whiz, but without one of those this is really shooting in the dark. Must be a mile of wires and a couple dozen connectors under the front end. Pity, it was doing pretty good there for awhile.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 16, 2019 8:40:47 GMT -6
Latest: ordered a more or less generic four wire key switch from a local Yamaha/Canam dealer, and will see what lights up or doesn't when I hook it up. Getting perilously close to putting this scoot on Craigslist as a mechanic special. Dealer was hyping the smaller Canam (?Ryker?) at about $8k, anybody have any experience to share? Looks like I'd have to accessorize quite a bit, windshield, saddlebags, etc., and of course it's a two in front about which I've heard some negative things.
MORE: reconnected the dashboard unit -- gauges, indicator lights, etc. -- now that I've built a plausible theory about what wire from the key switch does what. Unfortunately, connecting battery 12v wire to black wire caused same behavior, everything on the dashboard lit up and stayed on, same as before I started all this. Not what I had hoped for, suggests to me a problem with the dashboard unit itself rather than the key switch; IceBear will probably want $1000 for a new one if that's my problem, and have it on back order for six months! If any thoughts out there about this behavior, I'm listening. (REMINDER: started with indicator lights flickering at higher RPM, then suddenly everything lit up and nothing actually works -- starter circuit, handlebar switches for lights, horn, nothing.)
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Post by ellpee on Mar 14, 2019 9:01:12 GMT -6
Picked up a butt-simple two-wire key switch but now grappling with what to do with the FOUR wires that came off the old switch. Have confirmed that red is battery 12v in, and lots of googling suggests the B/W is for the starter button and solenoid via the brake handles. Black is presumably 12v out for everything else, and green is surely ground but the 2 wire switch has no ground connection.
Would prefer to just get a four-wire, but all the ones I've found so far at Autozone, etc., have an ACC and START position that I don't want or need. All the old one had was on and off, basta. What might be a good source for four wire scooter key switches with on/off only?
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Post by ellpee on Mar 12, 2019 11:08:52 GMT -6
Rapid Jim confirms those re "mystery wires" are simply for illumination of the keyhole, so nothing critical to anything else on the scoot. If I go generic can just deadhead them and ignore them. (Never actually knew the keyhole had a light!)
Which leaves me with the question, why would a simple on/off switch have FOUR wires? Guessing 12v in, 12v out to solenoid via starter switch, 12v out to everything else, and something else. Ground, maybe? Wires are red/black/green, one of those colors is usually ground, correct? Will be doing a lot of voltmeter testing before I make any firm connections, don't want a meltdown.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 11, 2019 13:21:15 GMT -6
Okay, hate to keep bugging him with no positive cash flow....
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Post by ellpee on Mar 10, 2019 19:13:36 GMT -6
Update, tore down the whole key switch assembly a level further, since one way or another it has to be replaced anyway.
Turns out that two-wire harness connects to a wafer circuitboard built into the assembly right at the front where you stick the key in, black cover gizmo that says on/off/lock. As far as I can tell it has 12v positive and ground, nothing else. No clue what it's for though, must have something to do with key position? What else in the Magnum's electrical might need to know that one bit of information?
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Post by ellpee on Mar 10, 2019 9:12:17 GMT -6
Pix, I hope. Big mystery is the two-wire harness that attaches to the assembly right by the keyhole -- what's it for?  0.2 MB DSCN1014.JPG Check Error 0.2 MB DSCN1015.JPG Check Error 0.2 MB DSCN1016.JPG Check Error 0.2 MB DSCN1017.JPG Check Error Well, that didn't work. Need a refresher on posting pix, been at least a couple years, things change. |
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Post by ellpee on Mar 9, 2019 18:52:45 GMT -6
To clarify, the solenoid-like thing is just a mechanical piston that locks the steering column in place, no relevance to the electrical part of this. But the two-wire harness remains a question: what does it do and can I dispense with it? Guy at he Yamaha shop says it looks like it might be sending a signal about key position to something, but to what?
In addition, looking closer at generic key ignition switches they all seem to have a position for cranking the starter, which of course I don't want -- just on/off, as I already have a starter switch for that purpose. So AutoZone may not be the answer, but now that I'm in this deep I'll keep googling.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 9, 2019 16:44:10 GMT -6
Okay, after considerable effort I finally got the old ignition key switch out of my Magnum, with an eye to maybe replacing it with a generic from AutoZone or wherever. HOWEVER -- there's always a HOWEVER -- I need some advice from anyone who is REALLY familiar with this switch.
It has THREE wire harnesses coming out of it. One, a two-wire harness, both red, that looks like it connects to the metal housing of the device rather than to any internal electrical stuff. Second, a single black/white wire. And third, a three-wire harness, green/black/red, that connects to the back end of the assembly and presumably takes care of the primary functions of the key switch. The latter two do come out of the back of the switch assembly and are hard-soldered to connectors under a rubber sleeve.
IN ADDITION, something I had not foreseen, it has a brass or copper piston-like thing sticking out one side that went into the metal mounting bracket, sort of like a solenoid. Moves back and forth about 1/4", no idea what it might be for.
So I'm at a loss what all these various things might be for and whether simply replacing them with a generic key switch is going to work. After I remind myself how to post pictures I'll do so, but in the meantime I'm hoping there's somebody out there reading this who is actually familiar in detail with Magnum electrical (or Zodiac or Tornado, guessing they'll have same ignition switch setup). If so, please make yourself known and we can strike up a conversation here.
Bear in mind, this assembly does more than just turn the key on and off. It also connected to a cable that, when the key was turned extreme left, would pop open the under-seat compartment, and it also had a separate locking mechanism that I believe was supposed to lock up the whole assembly so the scoot could neither be started nor the seat opened up. Not sure on that last part, never used it.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 7, 2019 8:23:09 GMT -6
Will give that some thought: pull out the entire Ice Bear thing and replace it with a simple AutoZone key switch and a pull knob to open the seat. Would involve some dashboard remodeling, but I'd never have to deal with this particular problem again. Question would be, will wiring setup on new switch correspond to the old one. Accurate Magnum wiring diagram would be great, but rotsa ruck on that.
Interestingly, Rapid Jim is saying possible R/R problem, R/R guru at Oregon Motorcycle Parts says nope, more likely the switch. Ask any two "experts" and you can expect three answers, I guess. Not to challenge either of them, just interesting how many points of view there can be about a problem.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 5, 2019 17:41:35 GMT -6
No change from spritzing in cleaner. Took off more plastic to try to get to where I could at least SEE, and hopefully remove, the ignition switch. On the Magnum, unfortunately, the electrical switch is integrated with a mechanical cable mechanism that opens the seat compartment if you turn the key counterclockwise. (Has never worked well since Day 1, potential Ice Bear buyers please note.) Haven't entirely figured out the disassembly part yet despite a couple small blood donations along the way, but since I can't ride it I might as well work on it. Silver lining, though, discovered a couple coolant-related rubber hoses that were poorly routed and consequently had kinks in them, so will correct that while I'm struggling with everything else. But Job#1 is getting the ignition switch and associated parts out of there so I can check it over for obvious problems and at least know if it's three wires, four, five, or whatever. The darn seat opener thing unfortunately chains me to Ice Bear for the most part, otherwise there are many, many ignition switches out there on the Internet that might serve as substitutes.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 5, 2019 8:35:45 GMT -6
Actually did that yesterday, no immediate effect, but will check it again this morning.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 4, 2019 14:29:38 GMT -6
Went out just now, fired it up and warmed it up, then ran the RPM up to problem level (flickering lights) while jiggling on the ignition key. Result: all dash indicator lights on continuously and start button won't work at all, so strong indication of problem in ignition switch. Rats, hard to get at, real spaghetti bowl of wires, and of course where to get replacement part. But at this point it does look like a faulty ignition switch might be the culprit. Fooey, those ought to last more than 2500 miles! But okay, now I at least have idea what direction to keep looking. Oh, and by the way, RapidJim says 6-8 weeks for part from Ice Bear due to back order situation. Hmmmm, let me think again, why was it I bought a product from Ice Bear? Caveat Emptor. |
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Post by ellpee on Mar 4, 2019 11:56:17 GMT -6
Well, Part A sounds manageable, Part B begins to sound scary. Will dive into the former and post results results for the benefit of all who come after.
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Post by ellpee on Mar 2, 2019 9:44:48 GMT -6
Got all the front plastic off, no obvious bad connections but I'm going to use spray cleaner and then dielectric grease on all of them, then do a test run with the plastic still off. Problem with this issue is, it doesn't happen when the scoot is standing still, have to get out on a bumpy street to see what happens. No shortage of those around my neighborhood though!
No test ride needed after all; checked almost all connectors behind the dashboard, started the scoot, and the flickering (accompanied by rough running) kicked in as soon as I revved it up to what would normally be road speed -- 40-50 mph range. So it's not about bumps so much, but rather about something in the electrical system that starts to complain at higher RPM and shows itself in at least two ways, flickering dash lights and pronounced engine miss. So again I'm not sure what component that might be, and welcome suggestions. R/R maybe? Other?
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