All Forum's Scooter Jeopardy: Let's Help them out By JR (Read 3,071 times)

[skyrider]

I'll throw in my two cents. I had the same stutter with my 2011 yy250t. Nothing I did seemed to help. In the process of regular maintenance I put a couple of drops of 90 w synthetic gear oil on the needle bearing. A drop or two got on the inside of the bell. Been as smooth as silk ever since and that is probably at least 3000 miles.

[alleyoop]

Well I pmed the guy and invited him to come over and open a thread with his problem and told him I would NOT get involved. So get your stories straight and no excuses otherwise I will post.
Alleyoop

[justbuggin2]

now now guys we are all here doing this as a way to share knowledge with each other and to help people with a common interests lets play nice and not get our panties in a wade

[alleyoop]

Well lets hope the guy comes on over and he can get his problem fixed once and for all.
Alleyoop

[JR]

Nov 13, 2012 23:07:40 GMT -6 justbuggin2 said:

now now guys we are all here doing this as a way to share knowledge with each other and to help people with a common interests lets play nice and not get our panties in a wade

OH no no panty wading! Alley and I carry on all the time. Alley is one of the best people I know and my friend, there's nothing I would not do for him.

We just don't agree here and I'll be the first to say that all Alley wants is for this guys scooter to run right, he could care less what fixes it, he's that kind of stand up guy.

I'm the first one who'll tell you that Alley is a decorated veteran like myself and loves to help people.

I've had this same problem and even though I don't think it's the clutch after all this guy has done if that proves out to be the case then I'll be the first in line to say "well he told me so" laugh and get my plate of crow out to eat!

Let's hope he does sign up and give "everyone" here a chance to solve this problem, we may all find something totally new and can add this to our list of possible solutions in the future.

Skyrider just made a suggestion and I also lube my roller bearings on routine PM work.

The main reason I don't believe it's the clutch is because Alley has made every suggestion on possible problems with the clutch that IMO it could be and he has replaced the clutch. If I remember correctly this scooter doesn't even have 1k miles yet?

John did touch on something also, large scooters do have this issue more than small ones.

Any other suggestions will be welcome.

JR

[alleyoop]

Right on JR, shit we can argue till the cows come home and disagree on many things and also poke fun at each other when one is wrong etc.. Heck JR was the one that thought me a lot of scooter stuff. Cars I know pretty damn well I am an old hotrodder and built my own hotrods, motors from the bottom up, rebuilt carbs all the time and or put in bigger ones, put in rear ends changed the gearing's, Clutches blown many of them(HAHA). So no we just happen to disagree on how to help this guy with what he perceives to be a problem. Now we may not be able to completely solve the slow speed shudder and that is because of the weight it has to pull at very low rpms, but maybe with a few tweaks here and there it will not be so violent.

So if anyone has anymore input by all means join in on the fun.
Alleyoop

[wheezy]

A guy I've been following on Youtube has an interesting video that may also possibly be the cause of a shudder on takeoff. He's got a Burgman 400 with a loose belt. The belt itself oscillates at takeoff, then settles in:

[alleyoop]

Yea, a lot of belts will oscillate if either they are a little to long or worn. But his Clutch pads are worn to almost nothing(HAHA), they are almost down to the metal.
Alleyoop

[terrilee]

NOW
i always say i am NOT a mech
and diagnosing is not my thing at all

so when yinz guys get answers
how about posting 'em

[JR]

Absolutely Terrilee this is what it's all about finding a problem and helping. This is one of these crazy quirks that if we all can figure out then when some future scooter owner has the same problem with folks can say" hey check this out".

Terrilee you try to help people too and I've noticed when something comes along that you've seen answers for then you're the first to jump on board and say "hey check this or that"

Don't have to be a mechanic just a good person like yourself who wants to help.

JR

[JR]

Well guys looks like contestant number 2 found the problem and is on his way but number 1 and 3 are still up in the air with no answers?

Number 4? Looks like Alley hit the nail square on the head with this one!

JR

[wheezy]

I agree with JLee on Contestant #1. It shows the signs of a dead short in the starter motor windings. The giveaway is it runs when kickstarted, but still drains the battery, even when sitting.

It's dangerous to simply change to a heavier guage wire without knowing what the current measurement is, or if it is overcurrenting. Doing so would invite MORE current flow, thus frying the battery or starter relay.

I can't find the wire diagram, but I assume it's fused? That's the only thing that doesn't make sense. If it is, why no fuse blown?

[damorg5623]

Hello there JR.
My name is Dan & I'm one of the the guys with the shuddering MC-54-250
As I understand it, there are several out there.
Just to get this out of the way, This is an almost brand new "2011" scooter.
I purchased it this year, back in July.
It does have the big rubber center stand stop/bumper attached, so that is not my problem.
I called Goldenvale/Roketa months ago asking about this shuddering problem, and the first thing they did was send me a new variator.
That turned out not to be the problem.
Then by posting on scooterdoc.com I was given some other suggestions on how to solve the shuddering and shaking problem.
I tried lubricating the clutch arm, pivot studs with some heavy gear oil, using a syringe oiler.
This did, as I posted solve the problem for several days.
My scooter took off from a stop as smooth as silk. I was also able to ride slowly thru a parking lot at speeds of less the 5 mph.
Before I lubed the clutch arm pivot pins, my scooter would have shuddered like crazy.
It was real embarassing when people would see how much my scooter would be shuddering.
Goldenvale/Roketa then sent me a new clutch assembly, I had to return the Variator, but this new clutch does the same thing, just not as bad.
The funny thing is that later on in the day that I installed this new clutch, I was supposed to go to my grandsons soccer game.
Because I was afraid that this new clutch might not solve the problem, I lubed it's pivot studs before I installed it.
Just like my original clutch, this new clutch took off as smooth as silk. The soccer game was about 25 miles away, so a round trip was about 50 miles.
Just as I was pulling up to my house, on my return trip home, this new clutch started to screw up.
However, the problem is a little bit different.
For a lack of a better way to express it, I will say it like this...
When I take off now, it's like I have a real motorcycle clutch and when the rpm's get to a certain speed, the transmission SLAMS in to gear.
It also shudders a bit, but no where near as bad as the original one did.
Now, I did notice the belt size, and it was different then what i had expected it to be.
The belt that is on my MC-54-250 says that it is a size 918 x 22.5
I sent an e-mail to Goldenvale/Roketa and asked them about this, and I was told that it was correct.
The reason that I questioned this is...
If you go on to the Roketa.com web site, and look up the MC-54-250 parts breakdown it doesn't show a picture of my belt, in the exploded view of the engine parts, nor does it list it in the parts breakdown list.
They do however list the belt for the MC-54B-250 and it is a different size then mine.
Anyway, It was suggested to me that if I were to sand down and shine the clutch arm pivot studs, that most likely would solve my shuddering problem once and for all.
I took the original clutch apart, since it was already off of the Scooter, to do that and I noticed that there are 3 little rubber rollers that the clutch arms lock on to when the clutch is idling, and I'm wondering if they are the problem. The clutch arms seem to really get hung up tight. I've sent some picture of this clutch and it's associated parts, including the little rubber rollers, to goldenvale/Roketa for their help.
I'm hoping that whoever built these clutches back in China put the wrong size little rubber roller on them.
They seem to measure (using a metric ruler) 11mm across.
Also, I noticed that there are 2 dings, it looks like they were made with a special tool. I'm guessing to balance my clutch assembly, they are in the clutch face plate.
There are also 2 dings in the clutch bell, I'm guessing for the same reason.
I've seen pictures of other clutches and they don't seem to have these dings.
Anyway, I'm currently awaiting a response from Goldenvale about the rubber rollers, and the dings.
If you have any other suggestions, I would greatly appreciate the help.
I am so tired of trying to figure this problem out.
I'm glad that winter is coming, that way I won't feel so bad when I see others happily riding down the road.

Thanks for your time and for any help you can give.

Dan

I tried to attach pictures of my disassembled clutch, I don't know if it worked.

Attachments:

[damorg5623]

Here's another picture,
Can you see the way the roller is being pinched inside of the clutch arm?
It looks too big to me.
I have another picture to post, I don't know how to post them all at the same time.

Dan

Attachments:

[damorg5623]

That's the wrong picture.
In this picture you can see the 2 dings, that I was talking about.
There are 2 dings on the clutch face plate, and the 2 dings that are on the bell.
Like I said, I'm guessing that they are there for balancing.

Dan