Clutch Bell/Variator Nuts By ellpee (Read 1,552 times)

[ellpee]

CONTEXT: 2011 (or 2012, depending on whom you ask) Roketa MC-54-250B, 2200 miles, need to "rough up" clutch pads to see if that solves low speed chatter problem. Too much wimpy new scoot driver stuff, maybe? Bucks like a bronco in the 5mph area, once up to 10mph, all is good.

Last minute reality check, because tomorrow I'm pulling the CVT cover and then making the rounds of nearby auto repair shops until I find somebody who for $20 will use their impact wrench to break loose the two nuts on clutch bell and Variator and then re-torque them to spec. (I tried getting off the nut on the clutch bell and couldn't budge it, not with an allegedly 150 Ft Lb Craftsman impact wrench and not with a 4' long breaker bar.)

FIRST, I'm assuming both are normal lefty-loosey thread. Correct?

SECOND, my Honda Helix manual, closest I've found, says variator nut should be about 70 ft lb, clutch bell nut should be about 40. Correct?

My intention is to have somebody loosen them, then re-tighten them to spec, so when I get back home I can remove (1) clutch bell for pad roughening and (2) if necessary after that, variator to check status of rollers.

Other, peripheral comments: wondering why these are so hard to remove. Red LocTite or Chinese equivalent? Also wondering, once I get the clutch bell NUT off, what I will find. At that point, is the clutch bell just supposed to slip off easily? And when I get it off, are the pads going to be fully exposed for roughing-up purposes, or will further disassembly be required?

[JR]

The threads are as you say lefty loosey. On the Chinese Loctite, who knows, sometimes I think if the Titanic had their stuff it would still be afloat! The pads will be easy to access once the clutch bell is removed. Sometime the heat from a map gas torch will make the Loctite melt and help the nut break free.

JR

[ellpee]

Thanks, JR. Wish me luck. I need to pass the skills test at DMV soon, and that bucking at low speed is really disconcerting in the cone weave or tight U turn.

[alleyoop]

Ellpee, Ride it to a garage and ask them to get the nuts off for you. You can ride it there without the CVT cover on. Then let them loosen it and tigthen them back on BUT only hit it with the IMPACT WRENCH 3 I SECONDS wraps, That is all I do on mine. THen start it up and rev it up and down a little if the nuts don't come loose ride it back home and you then will be able to use your impact wrench on it.
Alleyoop

[ellpee]

Yup, that's the plan, except if I can pull the clutch bell easily while at the garage I'll hit the pads with sandpaper right there and be done with it. Main thing is, I want to be able to get the nuts off the next time something needs doing. Jonway must've had King Kong tightening those nuts at the factory.

[ellpee]

Okay, the After-Action Report: Went to a nearby mechanic who used his impact wrench to loosen the two nuts without problem. Pulled off the clutch bell and hit the pads with coarse sandpaper, put the bell back on, reinstalled the nut, all good. Went to re-tighten the variator nut and had a bit of a problem because the belt had gone loose, and tightening the nut wasn't tightening the belt. Loosening the nut had apparently allowed the pulley to open up, creating slack in the belt, and the belt itself was preventing the pulley from closing back up again as the nut was tightened. Held the belt while the mechanic tightened, and got it as good as we could, then ran the engine for a minute, which allowed the variator to do its thing and presto, the belt was tight again. Hit the nut a couple times with the impact wrench, and all good as far as I can tell.

Roughening up the clutch pads worked wonders; zero jerking and shuddering at low speed during the first 10 miles. All the difference in the world.

With the covers off, though, I heard a much more noticeable "rattling" that I presume is the rollers in the variator. I didn't notice any problems in performance, normal startup/acceleration/cruising, and rattling stops as speed increases, so I'm hoping the noise is normal and I'm only noticing it more because the cover is off. Will put the cover back on when things cool down and see if I'm right. If not, I'm now gutsy enough to open up the variator and check things out, but will first watch a couple of the how-to videos.

Thanks to all on this forum for help and encouragement.

[alleyoop]

FANTASTIC!! But now that the nuts have been taken off once they will NOW be easier to take off and you will be able to use your impact wrench

The rattling are your rollers they do fit rather loose in the ramps and bounce around you will hear them more when at idle when they are down on in the ramps. Once you get up there they will quiet down because of the pressure put on them.

I believe that is why on the 250s+ they load it with grease and have a cover on the back of the variator to make them quiet all the time.
Alleyoop

[ellpee]

Put the cover back on and took it around the block, and the rattling is much less noticeable -- think I'm all good. What a relief, and yes, I'm certainly hoping I'll be able to loose those nuts with my own tools from now on. I can foresee that those pads may need an occasional touchup, though I hope my driving habits have improved after 2200 miles. Now all I have to do is pass the darn driving test.

[ellpee]

"I believe that is why on the 250s+ they load it with grease and have a cover on the back of the variator to make them quiet all the time."

So when the day comes that I get into the variator I should expect to find grease? Have read elsewhere that the rollers and their grooves need to be clean and smooth and grease-free.