|
|
Post by damin69 on Mar 30, 2012 19:34:13 GMT -6
Not yet. But sure am thinking about getting one.
|
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Mar 30, 2012 20:19:47 GMT -6
Todd STOP what your doing !!!!!!!!!!!!
I made this mistake twice because I didn't know better . You need to hone the new cylinder/jug , that is the only way the rings will set right . If you put it back together take it back apart , go get the honing tool . Then reassemble . I hope I cought you in time .
John
|
|
|
|
Post by JR on Mar 31, 2012 5:37:19 GMT -6
Todd I agree hone the cyclinder. I have used fine emory cloth when I absolutely couldn't get a honing tool but they are cheap. Use engine oil and hone the cyclinder so the rings will properly set, doesn't take much but it needs to be done.
JR
|
|
Sophomore
Currently Offline
Posts: 81
A+'s: 0
Joined: Dec 28, 2011 10:57:49 GMT -6
|
Post by imnts2 on Apr 1, 2012 7:58:50 GMT -6
Hang in man. Tries the patience to say the least.
|
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Apr 2, 2012 1:31:51 GMT -6
Todd how are you making out ?
John
|
|
|
|
Post by damin69 on Apr 2, 2012 8:44:44 GMT -6
Making out just fine. Most likely will not be back on finishing up putting motor back together until this next weekend. Looking like it will be a 60 plus hour week again at work. So with an hour drive each way to and from work I will be doing good to go home catch a few hours of sleep before I have to be back to work... boy life is good huh?  |
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Apr 2, 2012 8:53:26 GMT -6
Feed your 401k not FICA
Did I catch you in time ?
John
|
|
|
|
Post by damin69 on Apr 2, 2012 11:41:50 GMT -6
Feed your 401k not FICA Did I catch you in time ? John Yes it is not together. but I do have to ask. I have looked at a lot of different material. I have never see anything that said HONE a brand new cylinder to get the rings to wear in properly. I was always under the impression with a brand new cylinder, piston and Rings that they would wear in together. So what is the purpose of honing a new cylinder? I know when I rebuild RC motors if I would be to do that to a new cylinder it would destroy the cylinder. The cylinder and piston in an Nito RC motor have to be brought up to temp and broke in to ensure that the piston and Cylinder wear in together to keep pinch and compression. |
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Apr 2, 2012 12:47:44 GMT -6
I don't have the answer , sprocket brought it to,my attention . After my second rebuild on the same engine .
John
|
|
|
|
Post by bobf on Apr 2, 2012 14:20:57 GMT -6
Oil retention in the crosshatching created by the honing. At least that is what it says in this article. .aa1car.com/library/honing98.htm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"> .aa1car.com/library/honing98.htmEngine Cylinder Bore Honing Copyright AA1Car When an engine is rebuilt, the cylinders usually need attention. Wear tends to create taper in the upper part of the cylinder that can reduce ring sealing and increase blowby and oil consumption if not removed. The cylinder may also be out of round, scored or have other damage that requires correcting before a new set of rings will seal properly. The main objective when refinishing the cylinders is to make the walls as straight as possible (no taper), the bores as round as possible (minimal distortion, which is especially important with low tension rings), to have the right amount of crosshatch for good oil retention and ring support, and to produce a surface finish that meets the requirements of the rings. This is done by boring and/or honing the cylinders in one or several steps with various types of abrasives (vitrified or diamond). After honing, the cylinders need to be cleaned remove residual abrasive and metallic debris that is left in the bores. Washing and scrubbing with warm soapy water will remove most of the unwanted material. But washing alone does not loosen or remove surface "swarf" such as torn or folded metal that can wear rings and delay ring seating. The only way to get rid of this material and smooth the bores is to "polish" the bores after honing with some type of flexible abrasive brush. |
|
|
|
Post by damin69 on Apr 2, 2012 19:21:44 GMT -6
Oil retention in the crosshatching created by the honing. At least that is what it says in this article. .aa1car.com/library/honing98.htm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">.aa1car.com/library/honing98.htmEngine Cylinder Bore Honing Copyright AA1Car When an engine is rebuilt, the cylinders usually need attention. Wear tends to create taper in the upper part of the cylinder that can reduce ring sealing and increase blowby and oil consumption if not removed. The cylinder may also be out of round, scored or have other damage that requires correcting before a new set of rings will seal properly. The main objective when refinishing the cylinders is to make the walls as straight as possible (no taper), the bores as round as possible (minimal distortion, which is especially important with low tension rings), to have the right amount of crosshatch for good oil retention and ring support, and to produce a surface finish that meets the requirements of the rings. This is done by boring and/or honing the cylinders in one or several steps with various types of abrasives (vitrified or diamond). After honing, the cylinders need to be cleaned remove residual abrasive and metallic debris that is left in the bores. Washing and scrubbing with warm soapy water will remove most of the unwanted material. But washing alone does not loosen or remove surface "swarf" such as torn or folded metal that can wear rings and delay ring seating. The only way to get rid of this material and smooth the bores is to "polish" the bores after honing with some type of flexible abrasive brush. Bob that is my point for the question. This is what to do to your Cylinder if you are just replacing Piston and Rings. But we are talking a new cylinder that has never been run. |
|
|
|
Post by tvnacman on Apr 2, 2012 20:09:58 GMT -6
Todd , Some things are just what they are . If I knew better at the time I would have put the time to hone the cylinder and I have since bought the tool from harbor freight .
John
|
|
|
|
Post by bobf on Apr 3, 2012 7:10:41 GMT -6
What I posted was just a couple paragraphs from a very long article. Much explained in there but what I posted seemed to make sense to me. Cross hatch the cylinder to hold oil for the working parts break in. Always knew of this honing and done it on cars and lawn mowers. So why not on scooters? I never really tried to over analyze the use of a hone. It only takes a few minutes to do.
.
|
|
Sophomore
Currently Offline
Posts: 81
A+'s: 0
Joined: Dec 28, 2011 10:57:49 GMT -6
|
Post by imnts2 on Apr 3, 2012 7:37:04 GMT -6
Are we confusing "rebuilding" using a used cylinder with new rings with rebuilding using new cylinder/piston.rings? Years ago I took several automive mechanics courses through correspondance with the U of Wiscons in a Madison and recall a discussion I had to write on replacing rings. I was instructed that the idea of the hone was to break the glaze so the new rings could seat. YOu get glaze from the combinataion of oil/wear/heat. Of course, on a car the cylinder we were working on was never new. A new sleeve sometimes that got a lot of machining to make it work.
But honing certainly would not hurt.
|
|
|
|
Post by justbuggin2 on Apr 5, 2012 19:00:08 GMT -6
it helps the rings to seat in and increases the compression and oil control a new cylinder will have rough machine marks and homing the cylinder removes them so the rings will seat correctly
|
|
