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Post by ellpee on Oct 26, 2014 9:11:42 GMT -6
The cooling system is working as it should now. There was a loose wire that needed to be replaced in the temperature gauge assembly and with that fixed the rest of it bumped back into action. If your cooling system is working well that's a good thing, but this reminds me of something I read in another thread that I found confusing. If your scoot is anything like my two, the temperature gauge in the dashboard has NOTHING to do with the fan circuit. The gauge is driven by a temp sensor that provides a variable ground as coolant temperature increases, which affects the gauge readings. The fan is activated by a completely different temperature sensor (probably on the radiator) that, when the coolant gets hot enough, acts as an on/off switch and allows 12v through to the fan. The two are in no way electrically connected or functionally related. Of course, your scoot may be wired entirely differently from mine, I can only comment from my own experience. All of which, of course, has nothing to do with the stalling problem you are now dealing with. But if your fan circuit starts misbehaving again, you might want to consider the above when chasing down the problem. And if you find that your scoot IS wired differently, by all means post that fact; I'm capable of learning from others too. |
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 26, 2014 11:45:04 GMT -6
Here is how to adjust your valves You should not have to be messing with the valves every time to get it to start and run.
1. Start the motor and let it Idle for about 5 minutes.
2. Then FOLLOW The Procedure on the VIDEO.
3. If you notice the Adjusters SHOULD both be close to the center.
There is a MARK on the Casing and lines on the adjusters, the center of the adjusters should be close to the MARK ON THE CASE, NOT a lot to the left or right of CENTER.
Alleyoop
ALSO TAKE A PICTURE OF THE VALVE ADJUSTERS, want to see where they are currently SET at.
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Post by scooterfan86 on Oct 26, 2014 13:26:27 GMT -6
The bolt for the exhaust valve adjustment is almost entirely to the right of where it can go. The engine only seems to turn over with a harsh rat-tat-tat coming from it like what's in the video when the bolt is loosened.. any further and it dies pretty quick... or at least this is what it was going yesterday. Right now it will start and get a bit over 2000 rpm and die. Thanks for all the advice from everyone.. I'm learning about all this as I go, trying not to make too many mistakes  It sounds like it could be a good time to open up the head and check out // replace the valves? I'll be sure to check that potentially pinched hose too but more and more seems to be pointing to the valves needing to be actually looked at//replaced. I've found potential replacements on a couple sites: .scooterparts4less.com/web_gas/4Stroke_Valve_set.htm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"> .scooterparts4less.com/web_gas/4Stroke_Valve_set.htm (the CG 250cc Water Cooled Vertical Motor Valve assembly) and here: .scrappydogscooters.com/CF250_Water_cooled_parts.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">.scrappydogscooters.com/CF250_Water_cooled_parts.html (CF250 valve replacement set) Would either of these work for a 250cc Titan (aka the l-roar) by znen, or would you have any other recommendations as far as tracking down valves? I do have a Honda Helix shop manual that has what appears to be an identical engine, and have a couple other youtube videos showing replacing the valves (my dad has a mold injection factory so I do realize how important precision is when it comes to the engine). I would also need a spring compression tool of some kind right? Any recommendations or things I should try? Thanks again for all the replies, I really appreciate it. I'll look into that hose right now... it would be quite a relief if it was actually pinched in some way! |
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 26, 2014 13:54:38 GMT -6
The rat-tat-tat is because the valve is to loose on the Valve Stem.
What you can do is hold the adjuster with pliers in then loosen the bolt and then you can move it little left or right and listen to where the motor runs and smooths out the best. That way your close to where it should be and it should not die on you.
But it could be that one of the valves is not sealing and loosing compression After the motor warms up a bit.
Alleyoop
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Post by scooterfan86 on Oct 26, 2014 14:09:52 GMT -6
Thanks alleyoop!The video is actually what I used when I originally adjusted the valves, but I think with the coolant problem things have gotten out of shape. I need to look into it at least before I feel comfortable riding any distance again.
It would be the valves to try replacing right? If they're warped or not seating properly they'd be the first thing to try to fix engine wise.. it that is where the problem is?
If anyone has recommendations as far as replacement valves and where to purchase them, or what tools I'd need that would be great information to have! I'd be cursing myself if I waited for parts only to find out they're the wrong ones haha.
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Post by scooterfan86 on Oct 26, 2014 14:12:10 GMT -6
And to be clear, at this point the engine starts, idles for a few seconds, comes close to 2000 rpm and then dies.. and to get that to happen the exhaust valve needs to be loose and rattling.. that sounds like a really good time to open it up and check things out and replace the valves but again any suggestions are appreciated.
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 26, 2014 14:39:09 GMT -6
Now that sounds like a problem with the exhaust valve binding and or bent and when the rocker puts pressure on it to push the stem down it dies on you cause it binds. So I think it is time to take the head off and check the valves and I bet the EXHAUST valve is binding on is why it will only start when loose but dies right away naturally.
Alleyoop
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Post by wheezy on Oct 28, 2014 13:29:09 GMT -6
Thanks for the responses, I'll be getting the carb//valves to where they need to be and try to see if burping the cooling system will work. ![]() I came across this bolt after taking the plastic off of the bike. It's just above the starter motor under the front of the seat, pointing forward on the bike. I can't for the life of me figure out what this screwed into, or what it's purpose could be. So far I can't find any other threads or places for something to be attached.. any ideas of what went here and how I'd go about replacing it? In any case loctite would definitely be part of the equation! The other end of the bolt is held in place by another bolt going through it's side, giving it some wiggle, almost like a hinge. I can get more pictures if needed.  That looks like the swing arm mount. It cushions the motor from the frame, but it's not in a place I am used to seeing it. On my JCL, it's connected to the large U-shaped frame crossmember under the seat. I'd have to see more pics from different angles (and behind) to see where it goes. It does look to me like it hasn't been missing for long. Otherwise, the cup would have the same road dust as the other frame pieces.  |
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Post by scooterfan86 on Oct 29, 2014 13:21:55 GMT -6
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 29, 2014 14:21:49 GMT -6
The way it is built on that mounting bracket I believe it is a damping adjuster for the motor.
Alleyoop
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Post by scooterfan86 on Oct 30, 2014 22:36:16 GMT -6
Each valve has 2 springs, an inner and an outer for a total of 4. The exhaust valve's inner spring was in 3 pieces. This seems very likely the cause of many of the problems.
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 30, 2014 23:32:11 GMT -6
Good find, that sure would be a major problem and why the adjuster is all the way to one side due to misalignment of the springs and probably binding.
Alleyoop
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Post by wheezy on Oct 31, 2014 5:55:53 GMT -6
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 31, 2014 12:05:03 GMT -6
Great find wheezy so it is a damper.
Alleyoop
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Post by scooterfan86 on Nov 9, 2014 17:30:45 GMT -6
Awesome, thanks for tracking down the damper! I was able to find a used one for the honda helix on ebay and got it for 20 bucks, installed it yesterday.
The new exhaust valve is in and seems to be working.. ignition is a little skippy at the moment with a rare bind.. when that happens I take my finger off and back on again and the engine turns over again.
The bike's running now, but the rpm is jumping a bit. The exhaust valve's adjustment screw is still very much to one side, no tapping or anything but it's not anywhere near the center alleyoop. I am looking into whether the timing could be off from when I re-installed the cam.
With a new valve, will there be a breakin-timeframe of sorts where I need to just ride around to get things to run smooth, or should I be smooth from the get go?
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..BAD TO THE BONE..
